Curse

Shadowmoon · Oct 10, 2007, 05:33 PM // 17:33

/half signed,
Only should be accoutn base for extreme grind titles, ~500 hours of work, only two titles fits that requirement that isn't accoutn already, wisdom and teasure hunter, all other dont' take that much time, and are "storyline" titles.

Snow Bunny · Oct 10, 2007, 07:40 PM // 19:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

You have to get to R8 Sunspear in Nightfall to even progress in storyline
You fail at internets.
Good day.

Hey jackhole.

Check this.

It's Rank 7, which is easily acquired.

Nice try though.

This is another version of an endless debate.

And guess what?

Too bad. It's not going to happen.

It'd be nice if your arguments actually added up, but they don't. And you have the burden of proof to push for this.

BlackSephir · Oct 10, 2007, 07:51 PM // 19:51

Hey genius.
Chech this.
My Canthan N moved to Elona, did all the quests available before she get the And a Hero Shall Lead Them quest and still didn't have enough points to R7.
Any other way besides grind to get to general? No.

Oh, btw people, lil' bunny has an announcement to make.

Quote:

It's Rank 7, which is easily acquired.

HEARD THAT?? It's official now, grinding is easy! Thank you lil' bunny, without you everyone would still think that grinding is hard and challenging thing!

Fail less plz, if you can.

Snow Bunny · Oct 10, 2007, 08:02 PM // 20:02

The scale from R7-R8 is rather steep, whereas the scale from r0-r7 is not really, considering the Land of Heroes mission should basically get you to r6 in one go, and getting from r6-7 is easily achievable through progression of the storyline and less so from grind.

And for your information, you don't need R7 if you're a foreign character. But nice work regardless.

I'll just ignore the 'lil bunny' euphemism, seeing as your information is incorrect.

But that's ok.

/fail

BlackSephir · Oct 10, 2007, 08:25 PM // 20:25

Maybe you're blind and didn't notice what I wrote.
Here, let me show it again so you'll understand.

Quote:

My Canthan N moved to Elona, did all the quests available before she get the And a Hero Shall Lead Them quest and still didn't have enough points to R7.
Any other way besides grind to get to general? No.

This here means that I did sub-quests and still had to grind?

And what mr. Fail says?

Quote:

And for your information, you don't need R7 if you're a foreign character. But nice work regardless.

Here, let me show you a thing from Wiki

Quote:

Foreign (non-Nightfall) characters no longer need to become Sunspear Generals for this quest. This change was implemented with the December 1st 2006 update.

Notice the important thing-

Quote:

This change was implemented with the December 1st 2006 update.

What's this word I'm searching for... Starts with 'n', ends with 'b' and rhymes with 'noob'.

Quote:

/fail

You do that often

lyra_song · Oct 10, 2007, 08:31 PM // 20:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

You have to get to R8 Sunspear in Nightfall to even progress in storyline
You fail at internets.
Good day.

And you can do it by doing quests...
Quests which are part of fleshing out the storyline.

The sunspear requirement creates a branching primary quest system, instead of a linear quest system.

And theres LOTS of quests that will fill the requirement.

As a matter of fact, they could have removed the rank requirement, and forced you instead to run around on quests of THEIR choice.

This is the same reason for the 10k Luxon/Kurzick faction wall.

You can choose how to go about, play PvP or play PvE to progress the story. Either way its to gain the trust of one side or another.

or they can remove the rank wall and force you on quests of their choice.

You see it as a grind, when really its designed to spread out the content into your choice of direction. Which would you choose?

Snow Bunny · Oct 10, 2007, 08:40 PM // 20:40

Your posts really do shake my belief in human intelligence and logic, but that aside

That update is close to a year old. Do you understand that it is irrelevant? Unconsequential?

I'm not even going to respond to the rest of your post, because it's poorly written and doesn't actually contribute to the discussion.

The fact remains; many characters across your account will have contributed to the faction titles, the hero title, and glad title, and champ title.

Only 1 will contribute to explorer/wisdom/etc, hence why it should remain that way.

And by the way Sephir -

noob doesn't "rhyme" with itself. It's the same word.

dumbass

BlackSephir · Oct 10, 2007, 09:14 PM // 21:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

And you can do it by doing quests...
Quests which are part of fleshing out the storyline.

The sunspear requirement creates a branching primary quest system, instead of a linear quest system.

I thought I just said it, I moved my N before from Cantha to Elona, did Sunspear quests and still had to grind with blessings.

Quote:

That update is close to a year old. Do you understand that it is irrelevant? Unconsequential?

Have you heard of past tense?

Quote:

I'm not even going to respond to the rest of your post, because it's poorly written and doesn't actually contribute to the discussion.

Of course. Go and hide.

Quote:

Only 1 will contribute to explorer/wisdom/etc, hence why it should remain that way.

Cool, only one thing- you forgot to mention WHY it should be this way.

Quote:

noob doesn't "rhyme" with itself. It's the same word.

Quote:

What's this word I'm searching for... Starts with 'n', ends with 'b' and rhymes with 'noob'.

Hahaha, I love your reading skills

lyra_song · Oct 10, 2007, 10:45 PM // 22:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

I thought I just said it, I moved my N before from Cantha to Elona, did Sunspear quests and still had to grind with blessings.

Does killing stuff thats along the way while questing count as grinding? I didnt really have much of a problem getting enough SS rank with my canthan monk.

Random State · Oct 10, 2007, 10:57 PM // 22:57

/signed

The simple fact of the matter is that a player who is spreading their time amongst multiple characters shouldn't be penalised or be disadvantaged over a player who is dedicating all their time to a single character.

For example, if I play 10 characters and identify 1000 gold items on each of them why should I be denied the maxed Wisdom title track because I didn't do it all with a single character. I've put in the same amount of effort as a player with a single character but won't have the title. The same could be said for Treasure Hunter, Skill Hunter.

I agree Survivor should be character specific (it has to be; it's linked to XP) and campaign specific titles like LightBringer and Sunspear but the player should be rewarded for their effort not the character the player has used to put in the effort.

If we are going to continue with character titles how about some new account level titles like Legionaire for X PVE characters on account at level 20. A Platoon title for characters at level 20 in a single campaign. I mean grinding multiple characters to level 20 should count for something, shouldn't it? How about Big Spender for X character slots purchased through the online store to make these characters? Or perhaps we should just follow the original suggestion.

David The Impaler · Oct 10, 2007, 11:11 PM // 23:11

The only qualms I have is that wisdom and treasure hunter titles are not account based, yet lucky and kurzick/luxon allegiance titles are (all give advantages in game). Why they have not changed this I do not know. MAKE TREASURE HUNTER AND WISDOM TITLES ACCOUNT BASED!.....pretty pls?

Faer · Oct 10, 2007, 11:12 PM // 23:12

Tsk. Simple conversations can get out of hand so easily.

More civility, less circularity, please.

creelie · Oct 10, 2007, 11:20 PM // 23:20

/signed a million times.

The PvP grinders get this feature, why don't we?

Pompeyfan · Oct 11, 2007, 02:36 AM // 02:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by gremlin

I think we have given the powers in the game something to work with here, although we would be better to refine our views till we come up with something more or less cohesive to present to arenanet or they may well do nothing.

More than happy to go with a majority view on this one because I for one am now posting with more passion than logic and soon may be posting incoherent drivel "if I havn't already reached that point"

Would it be fair to say that

1/ we would like all the titles to be achievable in difficult but interesting ways
if not possible then

2/ remove some of the repetition by making those that are very depressingly boring and repetetive account based so you only have to do them once.
or

3/ Something else should be done as the present situation doesn't please anyone very much.

4/ Some titles however grinding must be considered player based because by their nature they are notable achievements.

If this isnt reasonable I think some of you should come up with a similar post that we can all "hopefully" aggree to as a compromise solution to an otherwise hopeless argument.

I'd go with 1 and 2, of your suggestions as it's the repetative boring stuff thats the problem - It's got to a point where I just can't face the minimum 70 required wurm runs to kill exactly the same creatures over exactly the same route every time to max out my R9 SS and R6 LB as getting them that far bored me to tears (yes I know there's other places to grind but then it'd take even longer and be just as boring).

Like you I enjoy RPG's and have played them for years (since the early 80's) but in all that time I've yet to play one that to make skills work better involved having to repeat the exact same actions in the exact same places 100+ times - yes you had to level up to improve things but the important and crucial difference is that the XP was gained from doing different things. I mean, how interesting would Dungeon's and Dragon's have been if the DM had you repeating the same small area 100+ times just to kill the same monsters so you could level up?

Anyway, I thought the idea of titles was to recognise skill not a high boredom threshold or ability to leech points (like Kurzrick where one person runs it and the other 7 just stand around chatting then talk to the NPC - yeah lots of skill required there).

The books in EOTN are a step in the right direction, but they should offer a higher reward to make them a viable alternative to grinding - maybe work out how long on average it'll take to do 20 dungeons and award the same number of points as would be gained by grinding for the same length of time, eg. If you can get 1k points an hour grinding and each dungeon takes an average of an hour to complete, then award each dungeon 1k points for completion - that then gives people the choice - either grind or quest in dungeons (I realise that that would mean it'd be possible to get extra Dwarf points, but then it evens out as a few dungeons take longer than a hour, and a few grind areas give more than 1k points an hour (outside olafstead is 4.5-6k points an hour - doubled this weekend if you have someone with the correct quest active)).

Perfected Shadow · Oct 11, 2007, 04:17 AM // 04:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

The fact remains; many characters across your account will have contributed to the faction titles, the hero title, and glad title, and champ title.

Only 1 will contribute to explorer/wisdom/etc, hence why it should remain that way.

And yet a lvl 1 char on your account who's never been close to the door of a pvp arena can display pvp titles.

So you're keeping to the roleplay argument that when a character works towards titles, only that character gets to display the title? (imo 'working towards' is a bad phrase, grinding is more accurate for many titles)

Guess who controls the character(s)?

Dean Harper · Oct 11, 2007, 04:22 AM // 04:22

/notsigned, this would make too many titles not worth the effort, they are what mainly keep a lot of older players playing...

Perfected Shadow · Oct 11, 2007, 04:27 AM // 04:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dean Harper

/notsigned, this would make too many titles not worth the effort, they are what mainly keep a lot of older players playing...

Interesting... Are you saying that those older players are only playing now to grind for those titles across several characters?

I'm more inclined to agree with the post below mine.

Curse You · Oct 11, 2007, 04:28 AM // 04:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dean Harper

/notsigned, this would make too many titles not worth the effort, they are what mainly keep a lot of older players playing...

They're also what makes a lot of older players (like me) reluctant to play. I just don't feel as motivated since I know that no matter how hard I try on one character, it wont have any effect on my other 9 characters.

Darkobra · Oct 11, 2007, 05:22 AM // 05:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curse You

They're also what makes a lot of older players (like me) reluctant to play. I just don't feel as motivated since I know that no matter how hard I try on one character, it wont have any effect on my other 9 characters.

And that's why I decided to play only my elementalist exclusively. And that makes the game dull quickly. So many characters, stick to playing one for full benefits! Let's hope GW2 doesn't make the same mistake.

Snow Bunny · Oct 11, 2007, 06:22 AM // 06:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfected Shadow

And yet a lvl 1 char on your account who's never been close to the door of a pvp arena can display pvp titles.

So you're keeping to the roleplay argument that when a character works towards titles, only that character gets to display the title? (imo 'working towards' is a bad phrase, grinding is more accurate for many titles)

Guess who controls the character(s)?

You didn't actually understand my argument there, but that's ok, you may quote me if you think it adds validity to your own post.

I'm honored, truth be told.

But, to entertain you, and perhaps enlighten you, I'll use a more pragmatic argument that will hopefully spur you to see my point.

There's no practical reason for grind-based titles to be account based. The only reason for Hero, Champ, and to a lesser extent, Glad's (I suppose for the 2nd two, not definite, but certainly for the first) it's to simply display the measure of skill

, perhaps these days, experience of the player in question in an arena with team formation (Heroes Ascent)

The only reason for the faction title to be account based is perhaps initially because of the same reason for the hero title, regardless of what the faction titles ended up meaning to most knowledgeable players.

With this in mind, there's no real reason for grind-based titles to be account-based. Perhaps the EotN titles, simply because grinding even one to a high level I can imagine is a nightmare on one character, let alone several, and it's acceptable for it to be account-wide only for the lvl 3,4,5 accessability.

But there is no practical reason for another title to be account based. In the case of wisdom/treasure hunter, just do all your chests and golds on one character, and salvage with that character. It's not that hard.

There's no good reason for this to be done. The pvp titles purportedly had their use, but most pve ones don't.